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[CLASS BUILD] Don Juan - Dedicated Trap/Secret Finder - A More Laidback & Passive Rogue

rogue passive lockpick arquebuss 2h DW

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#1
K-Slash

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The idea for Don Juan, came to me after eating breakfast a year ago on a Sunday morning. From that point onwards, I realised that a dedicated trap-finder/secret finder is damn useful. Having someone to help kill things is always nice too. So, here's Don Juan. 

 

===================================

Don Juan

===================================

Difficulty: Easy/Normal/Hard v. 3.02 and previous versions.

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Class: Rogue

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Race: Elf (+1 Dex +1 Perception), Subrace: Wood Elf
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Starting Attributes:

MIG:16

CON:16

DEX: 16

PER:16
INT: 3
RES: 10

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Culture: Don Juan had travelled all over Eora during his younger years.

Deadfire Archipelago (+1 DEX) or The White that Wends (+1 PER). Choose the one that you think is coolest.

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Background: Don Juan had tried his hand at many lines of work over the years, his skill was always in the mechanical.

Labourer (1+ to Mechanics/Athletics), Merchant (+1 to Mechanics/Lore) or Scientist (+1 to Mechanics/Lore).

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Skills: Dump as many points into Mechanics as you can (try to hit 10 asap) and then expand with left over points into Survival (Cap it at 9 for the +2 movement speed rest buff).

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Talents:
Level 1: Sneak Attack, Crippling Strike
Level 2: Weapon Focus: Soldier
Level 3: Reckless Assault
Level 4: Vulnerable Attack
Level 5: Dirty Fighting
Level 6: Shadowing Beyond
Level 7: Vicious Fighting
Level 8: Quick Switch
Level 9: Persistent Distraction

Level 10: Arms Bearer

Level 11: Deathblows

Level 12: Interrupting Blows

Level 13: Sap

Level 14: Arms Bearer

Level 15: Shadow Step

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Explaination of Talents:

Crippling Strike (Active - 2 per Encounter): You get to use it twice an encounter, and with Don Juan's horrendous INT being able to do it twice is twice as nice.

Weapon Focus (Passive): Soldier: For that lush +6 to hit stuff.

Reckless Assault (Modal - Accuracy): When you want to rush in an lamp things.

Vulnerable Attack (Modal - DR modification): Brilliant talent, much love for this.

Dirty Fighting (Passive): Crits make things explode into chunks.

Vicious Fighting (Passive): Chunky goodness expanded.

Shadowing Beyond (Active - 2 per Rest): Nice for running away and getting healed. Even nicer if you just go invisible and then cast a scroll/shoot someone in the face.

Persistent Distraction (Passive): -1 Engagement for your target is annoying as all hell. -6 to all Defenses is beautiful.

Interrupting Blows (Passive): Perception + High Interrupt Weapon + Interrupting Blows = Interruptmania, with more science! :D

Quick Switch (Passive): The opening volley of a fight will help loads when facing tough creatures.

Deathblows (Passive): Gorgeous passive talent. Makes me very happy.

Sap (Active - 2 per Encounter): Stun them. Stun them good.

Feign Death: Use this to take a breather. Don Juan had feigned his own death fourteen times in the last year alone.

Shadow Step: Know nothing about this, but it sounds cool. Here's the relevant copypasta: By stepping through the Between (?!?!?!), a rogue is seemingly able to teleport across the battlefield for a few moments, automatically returning to his or her starting position when the effect ends.

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Weapons

Arquebus/Pliambo per Casitàs(!)/Long-Feller(!) - Custom Arquebusses would do awesome as well.
Greatsword/Pikes/The Hours of St Rumbaldt (!)/Tidefall(!)/Tall Grass (!) + Durganized Steel + Corrosive Lash

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Weapons and Armor
Head: Dandy Hat of the Diseased Yak
Armor: Coat of Ill Payment/Sanguine Plate
Hands: Gauntlets of Accuracy/Gauntlets of Swift Action/Gloves of Manipulation
Boots: Shod-in-Faith
Belt: Coil of Resourcefulness/Don Paco's Codpiece of Vigor
Rings: Your choice, as long as you're happy.
Cloak: Liliths Shawl/Hiro's Mantle

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Equipment

Every lockpick you see. Food that helps PER / DEX. Potions that speed him up.

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Play Style: While the rest of the party forms a defensive line or gets stuck into the enemy. After the mage has ganked the enemy, have Don Juan open with a rifle round to somethings face. Then, quick switch to another rifle, doing the same again. Or a scroll of something hilarious, bouncy and painful. When all ranged weapons have been emptied, find a nice target with lots of health with dehabilitating effects on it, run in and gut it. Rinse and repeat.

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Formation Postioning: Place Don Juan somewhere in the back lines, then when the time is right, run out and stab something. Works especially well in the middle field, beside a pally or fighter with a pike. Or EVEN BETTER, the party Cypher/s (OUCH! THAT'S GONNA STING).

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Legendary Don Juan - Dual Wield Style / The Blender Version

Rumours speak of Don Juan wielding two-weapons...

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Level 1: Sneak Attack, Crippling Strike
Level 2: Weapon Focus: Ruffian
Level 3: Reckless Assault
Level 4: Vulnerable Attack
Level 5: Dirty Fighting
Level 6: Shadowing Beyond
Level 7: Vicious Fighting
Level 8: Two Weapon Fighting

Level 9: Persistent Distraction

Level 10: Quick Switch
Level 11: Deathblows

Level 12: Interrupting Blows

Level 13: Sap

Level 14: Arms Bearer

Level 15: Shadow Step

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Weapons

Blunderbuss/Lead Spitter (!!!)/Scon Mica's Roar

Any two Sabres/Resolution(!)/Purgatory(!)+Durgan Steel+Corrosive Lash

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Play Style: As above, but even closer to the action. Just fire the Blunderbuss when enemies reach your lines and are getting magicked. Then move in and turn on the blender.

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Formation Postioning: As above, maybe a little closer to the enemy but not at the front.

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Thanks

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The team at Obsidian for making an awesome game. Thanks to AndreaColombo, Boeroer, Blunderboss, LadyCrimson, Blovski and other users who'd posted awesome builds/advice. Special thanks to you, for reading.

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Discussion

If you have any more ways to make Don Juan more awesome, please post below. I'll be happy to reply to you, he's not my precious, so if you know of ways to make him more optimal then I'll be happy to take it onboard.

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EDITS:

#1: Gloves of Manipulation added to Equipment

#2: Rejigged the Attributes

#3: Included the Coil of Resourcefulness (I love it.)

#4: Riposte added to the build. Thank you, Patch 3.03. :aiee:

#5: Rejigging of the stat block.

#6: Rejigging again. Need more wham.

#7: Removed all reference to Scrolls. Having low INT meant that the AOE's were tiny. Maybe best to leave the magic to the mages.

#8: Rejigged stats for maximum *wablam* and removed Riposte, replaced with Interrupting Blows. Added Shadow Step, even though I know nothing about it. But it sounds cool.  :bow:  

Attached Files


Edited by K-Slash, 16 September 2016 - 10:50 AM.

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#2
Ben No.3

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If I remembered it correctly, there are gloves that give a huge bonus to trap accuracy (like 18 or something) and a +1 to Dex... These might fit well with your build. Then I'd value Int above Res... Rouge has poor defenses anyway, and good old Don could gain a lot from longer Effect-durations. Like say, longer negative effects for enemies thus more sneak attack hits. I'd also consider the possibility of going riposte with this one... Might fit the idea of a more passive rouge. Maybe for riposte something like M15-C16-D3-P16-I10-R18. Dumped Dex because of the way riposte works. High Per and Mig to get the most out of an attack. High Con and Res for high Defenses, no dumped Int for the same reason and to avoid shorter Durations. Pick up good armour (ideally plate), a small shield and a hard hitting weapon. I personally like maces and warhammers for riposte (but then again I rarely use it). Or the sabre with the fireball enchant from the endless paths. Use any sort of item that boosts your defenses, we need those desperately (unless something boosts mech, then you might consider using that for the sake of the build's main theme). Don't use the riposte as a main tank though...
And just to be picky: You put Dex and Con the wrong way around ;) .
But nice build anyway :) it's cool to see a "classic" rouge postet around here ;)
Two Big edits.... Sry ;)

Edited by Ben No.3, 11 September 2016 - 09:10 AM.


#3
K-Slash

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Are they the Gloves of Manipulation per chance? Yeah, they're awesome. Thanks. :)


Edited by K-Slash, 11 September 2016 - 08:30 AM.


#4
Ben No.3

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i don't think it were +2 mech, but specifically trap accuracy... I'll look into it. But obviously Gloves of manipulation are awesome as well.Hopefully I'll have a chance to play the game today... :(

Edited by Ben No.3, 11 September 2016 - 02:44 PM.


#5
L4wlight

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I think you were talking about the belt Coil of Resourcefulness which gives +15 trap accuracy, Mini Quick Switch and +1 DEX.

Edited by L4wlight, 11 September 2016 - 11:29 AM.


#6
Ben No.3

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YES! Thanks :)

Edited by Ben No.3, 11 September 2016 - 10:47 AM.


#7
K-Slash

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If I remembered it correctly, there are gloves that give a huge bonus to trap accuracy (like 18 or something) and a +1 to Dex... These might fit well with your build. Then I'd value Int above Res... Rouge has poor defenses anyway, and good old Don could gain a lot from longer Effect-durations. Like say, longer negative effects for enemies thus more sneak attack hits. I'd also consider the possibility of going riposte with this one... Might fit the idea of a more passive rouge. Maybe for riposte something like M15-C16-D3-P16-I10-R18. Dumped Dex because of the way riposte works. High Per and Mig to get the most out of an attack. High Con and Res for high Defenses, no dumped Int for the same reason and to avoid shorter Durations. Pick up good armour (ideally plate), a small shield and a hard hitting weapon. I personally like maces and warhammers for riposte (but then again I rarely use it). Or the sabre with the fireball enchant from the endless paths. Use any sort of item that boosts your defenses, we need those desperately (unless something boosts mech, then you might consider using that for the sake of the build's main theme). Don't use the riposte as a main tank though...
And just to be picky: You put Dex and Con the wrong way around ;) .
But nice build anyway :) it's cool to see a "classic" rouge postet around here ;)
Two Big edits.... Sry ;)

 

Thanks, makes Don even more fun. I've updated the main post. Not the biggest fan of Riposte because it's because it's 20% on a miss. But I am a big fan of high RES, which will even out his defences a lot more. Thanks for the edits, I'll incorporate your words into the OP.

 

EDIT: HOT DIGGITY, Riposte triggers on grazes too. Brilliant!

 

 

I think you were talking about the belt Coil of Resourcefulness which gives +15 trap accuracy, Mini Quick Switch and +1 DEX.

 

Gawdddammn, that's insane. -1 Recovery is awesome! And the trap accuracy is pretty lol too. Thanks.


Edited by K-Slash, 11 September 2016 - 12:20 PM.


#8
Ben No.3

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You should add on a side note that low Dex only is viable with Riposte, otherwise it is simply to slow...

#9
K-Slash

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Hmm... I'm gonna have to sit down with a calculator and the stat bonuses and see if I can give them a quick rejangle. You're right, the speed is far too slow at DEX 4.

 

EDIT: Right, looked at the stats and they all seem to follow a linear progression with smaller additive bonuses that I previously realised. So to rejangle the stats I've put them in terms of necessity to the character.

 

STR: **

DEX: ***

CON: *****

PER: ***

INT: *

RES: *****

 

Natively, a rogue (or rouge) has:

 

Endurance 36 + 12/level (Very Low) Health Endurance x4 (Low) Deflection 15 (Low) Accuracy 30 (Very High)

 

So to shore up the weakness, I think the CON + RES buffing is entirely legitimate. Having super high STR and PER, isn't what I thought it would be. In BG and similar, the stats get way stronger the more they're buffed, in PoE they gradually increase to a point.

 

While buffing initially rubbish statistics is a good way to round out the character, the impact in the field will also be increased due to effective use of status effects and stacking with sneak attack.

 

Core concept of Don Juan is a reliable source of damage, with inbuilt mechanical buffs for your everyday dungeon crawling needs. So with the minimum micro the character is built around (namely patience and choosing which target to evicerate), I think the following stat block would be the most balanced and fun:

 

Mig:10

Con:18

Dex: 10

Per:19
Int: 3
Res: 18


Edited by K-Slash, 12 September 2016 - 03:38 AM.


#10
Ben No.3

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Isn't a DD fighter more what you are looking for?

#11
Ben No.3

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Isn't a DD fighter more what you are looking for?

#12
K-Slash

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DD Fighter???

 

EDIT: Updated OP again. He works better as a rogue's rogue rather than a fighter's rogue. Dunno how to describe that but basically, an opportunist that goes for targets with High Deflection and low Concentration.

 

Double EDIT: Have prayed to the Gods of Optimization. Oh, I but just a lowly scrub, furnish me with your wisdom.

 

Triple EDIT: Have prayed at the Temple of Eternal Enlightenment. May the High Gods of PoE provide me with strength and purpose.


Edited by K-Slash, 12 September 2016 - 06:00 AM.

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#13
Ben No.3

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DD=Damage Dealer
A DD fighter is a fighter focused on dealing damage rather than defense. Their very sturdy, and their high acc and talents like weapon mastery and confident aim make them excellent reliable damage dealers

#14
Sking

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Look at you beautiful scientists,

 

1. I'd drop Shadowing Beyond or Feign Death, no need for both. Probably hit another sweet new White March 2 ability. Cough* cough* 'buy our expansions' :).

2. Wood Elf is all wrong. I'd hit a tankier race; Wild Orlan or Fire Godlike.

3. Quickswitch.... thought you were going for minimal micro management?

4. My tank Rogues always rocked shields, not sure how they'd match up to a duel wielder but grabbing Weapon Shield Style and sitting on Retaliates/Ripostes always worked well for me.

 

- Sking


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#15
Ben No.3

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Look at you beautiful scientists,

1. I'd drop Shadowing Beyond or Feign Death, no need for both. Probably hit another sweet new White March 2 ability. Cough* cough* 'buy our expansions' :).
2. Wood Elf is all wrong. I'd hit a tankier race; Wild Orlan or Fire Godlike.
3. Quickswitch.... thought you were going for minimal micro management?
4. My tank Rogues always rocked shields, not sure how they'd match up to a duel wielder but grabbing Weapon Shield Style and sitting on Retaliates/Ripostes always worked well for me.

- Sking

Just wondering... What was your idea for the devil? 40% penalty? Really? ;)
Right now she's gunning (she's not the best companion, but awesome to have around) to avoid huge speed loss through the penalty. Thinking of trying to riposte her... What were the original thoughs? :)

Edited by Ben No.3, 12 September 2016 - 10:44 PM.


#16
Sking

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Devil is very underrated in my opinion. Vessel immunity's are totally worth the the permanent breastplate. She just isn't min/max friendly. 



#17
bigwillystyle

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She's actually good with a shield / weapon & shield style / open encounter with Escape.  Is she optimal?  No.  But then again, neither are Rogues in the general case :)



#18
Boeroer

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For party play, she's awesome. Vessel immunities can be "abused" to gain big advantages.

I also don't get the Wood Elf thing.

Riposte is only worth it if you combine it with a shield and Escape in my opinion. Else your deflection isn't high enough to produce grazes and misses reliably.
Also works OK when you stack defenses against disengagement attacks (up to +32 passive) - maybe then you can do without a shield.

#19
K-Slash

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*** Massive thank you to everyone for the replies, reads and two cents/pence.***

 

The proto-type for Don Juan goes all the way back to when Tales of the Sword Coast came out (I was around 14 at the time) and I wanted a tankier, damage dealing Rogue that would allow me to do Durlag's Tower.

 

So I made a Fighter/Rogue Multiclass to kill stuff, deal with traps and stay alive between load game screens. I had to make the character an Elf with Greatsword and Longbow proficiency. With access to Find Traps and could strip out of Full Plate to Disable Traps. Was much fun, difficult as all hell but fun. I thought the concept of a Fighterish Rogue or maybe a Roguish Fighter would work good with PoE's delicious skills system.

 

DD=Damage Dealer
A DD fighter is a fighter focused on dealing damage rather than defense. Their very sturdy, and their high acc and talents like weapon mastery and confident aim make them excellent reliable damage dealers

I'm definitely interested in this. Maybe I should scrap the whole Don Juan is a Rogue with Fighty bits idea and go with Fighter with Roguish bits instead.

 

I also don't get the Wood Elf thing.

Riposte is only worth it if you combine it with a shield and Escape in my opinion. Else your deflection isn't high enough to produce grazes and misses reliably.
Also works OK when you stack defenses against disengagement attacks (up to +32 passive) - maybe then you can do without a shield.

 

I'd rather do without Riposte in hindsight, Don keeps getting smacked and then Riposte doesn't trigger. Maybe Savage Attack + Reckless Assault + Vulnerable Attack? Or something else? Maybe I should scrap the whole Rogue part and go with Fighter all the way.
 

 

Look at you beautiful scientists,

 

1. I'd drop Shadowing Beyond or Feign Death, no need for both. Probably hit another sweet new White March 2 ability. Cough* cough* 'buy our expansions' :).

2. Wood Elf is all wrong. I'd hit a tankier race; Wild Orlan or Fire Godlike.

3. Quickswitch.... thought you were going for minimal micro management?

4. My tank Rogues always rocked shields, not sure how they'd match up to a duel wielder but grabbing Weapon Shield Style and sitting on Retaliates/Ripostes always worked well for me.

 

- Sking

 

1. What is this sweet WM2 ability you're hinting at? *sneeze* *burp*

2. ^^^ See opening reply. Explains the race choice. ^^^

3. Quickswitch is pretty minimal micro management to be honest. Fire, then change, start swinging.

4. Would prefer to go without shield to be honest.

 

So, in short, I've had a character crisis of faith. Thank you all, deeply and sincerely.



#20
Boeroer

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Ok, you took wood elf out of nostalgia, that's totally ok then. :)

Sadly, Savage Attack + Reckless Assault don't work together. It's either one or the other (modal).

A pure DPS fighter and a sturdy rogue (without shield, but Veteran's Recovery and stuff) can be played quite similarly.

The rogue has the better mechanics skill of course.

Edited by Boeroer, 16 September 2016 - 10:46 AM.






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